Scan and print larger for lost-wax process

[yliptical]

I exploring options to scale up a small glass sculpture (13x8x8 cm).

I envisage it would be possible to scan it and reproduce it doubled in size in another material. ( I would use the new model as a master for hand making making a mould for a lost-wax process). In a perfect world the 3d model would be made wax, which would reduce the number of steps to a new glass casting but I’ve only seen jewellery-sized 3d was printers.

[3DPrintandStuff]

Hi Mike,

It seems possible to produce a 3D printed model from wax, as I have just found this company (in US) http://www.machinablewax.com/product.php?product=52 which sells Filament suitable to be used in a 3D FDM printer.

I’m thinking that scan might not be able to tell where the edges of glass sculpture are; As the laser light could/might go though rather than bounce off. The 3D point map might need to be cleaned up around the edges before producing the STL for printing.

Running some tests with the scanner should enable you to find out what works or doesn’t work.

My printer is currently undergoing a upgrade to Duel extruder’s so it’s off-line (not seen on 3D Hubs) at the moment, hopefully back on by the end of the week.

As for doubling the size 26cm x 16cm x 16cm that would be outside by print build area of 20cm x 20cm x 20cm or 200mm x 200mm x 200mm. I’m sure you could make it smaller or find a printer with a larger build area.

Hopefully that helps you and I might be able to help you with this, once the printer is back on-line.

Regards

Chris Hills

[yliptical]

Thanks Chris I dropped them a line about the wax. They talk about burn-out which is how metal casting works. I’m casting glass and the wax is typically steamed out of the wax (melting about 70c), before the investment mould goes into the kiln.

Im ok with making a plastic 3d and then making a silicon master mould from that if the repro is good. Otherwise I would look for a 3d that I can re-work/clean-up. As a test I would be happy to go to the max possible size. The glass piece I am thinking of is heavily enamelled which would make it quite opaque or I can use marker pen over it and clean that off with methylated spirits afterwards. I can send an image if you give me an email address. Mike

[MindFuLL]

I print casting wax which is used to make molds for metal casting. If you need a mold for plastic/rubber type of material, I print several materials with a high glass transition temperature(temp where they start to get soft) like polycarbonate or PEEK that might work for directly printing the mold.
Let me know if you have any questions or if you thing I could help. My hub: https://www.3dhubs.com/miami/hubs/mindfull and email: -Jesse

[gabriela3d]

Hey Mindfull, just a heads up I moderated your email out. Moving forward, can you please use only your Hub link as means of contact? Especially now that we have clickable user profiles Cheers

[3DPrintandStuff]

Hi Mike,

Further research found also found a suitable filament called moldlay which is available from UK and Europe suppliers. The process they mention is 3D print at low temp 135 degrees C then encase in concrete, once set, place in oven at 270 and the moldlay filament melts out; into which you place the final material.

I don’t have access to a scanner nor used one to produce a 3D model, so not sure what the scan will produce.

Drop us an email on info3dprintandstuff.co.uk So I’m able to let you know when my printer is back on-line.

Interested in the image or the total volume of the piece so able to work out costs but we might not know the final cost until the scans are done and produced STL file is received

Regards

Chris Hills

[MindFuLL]

You cannot be serious. Almost all of my clients are working on prototypes and demand confidentiality. My last two 3d hubs orders required a lot of e-mail correspondence including the signing of a non disclosure agreement. How do you expect me to do business without giving out my e-mail contact? I have been 3d printing for years but I just started 3d hubs. If this is the new policy it raises doubts about how it can fit into my business model which is a shame because I wanted to start having outside customers place their orders through my hub. Please let me know what’s going on. This is very concerning to me.
-Jesse

[Pot8oSH3D]

Hi Mike,

I should be able to scan your sculpture on my Matter and Form laser scanner and produce a watertight mesh in STL or OBJ format. I say “should” because it’s all down to the shape. If this sounds like what you’re after, shoot me a message and let’s have a chat about it.

Cheers,

AndyL

Pot8oSH3D <------ Click here to message

[yliptical]

The wax needs to melt much lower for glass casting as the wax gets steamed out. One alternative that just occurred is to print the mould, the inverse. That would need to be in something very flexible and capable of withstanding hot wax

[yliptical]

Is it possible to print the mould which is the inverse of the piece? A flexible and temperature resistant rubber into which I would pour hot wax? Attached is the glass piece

[3DPrintandStuff]

Yes, You would need to scan the glass piece to produce a 3d STL file, print it with moldlay filament, then encase in suitable material (concrete) place inside a baking oven at 270 degrees c, which will cause the moldlay to melt out and leave a negative of the glass piece inside; In to which you pour you final material.

Using steam to heat something up to remove it, Is using a very “wet” kind of heat;

You will get a better result with “dry” heat which at 270 c from a oven or even a hot air gun will melt most things pretty well to a liquid state.

Here is a you tube video showing the process with moldlay.wax filament lost wax casting with MOLDLAY 3d Filament - YouTube

[yliptical]

Probably I need to get hold of some moldlay and try that technique as a technical test. Kiln firing glass using lost wax may appear similar to metal techniques, appear! it is not concrete that is used but a Quartz/plaster/clay investment mix. Glass goes in cold and melts in the kiln, it can be in there for days in a multi-stage heating & cooling cycle. Peeking into the kiln opportunities are limited. Cracks are not good and risk kiln damage. Unmelted wax will cause noxious fumes in a kiln etc.

[3DKEV]

I might be able to help you out.

I do CAD work and 3D modelling/3D printing with ceramic artist.

So I have some experience in mould making.

I also make my own silver jewellery trough the lost wax method.

Besides that, I have 2 3D scanner, one laser based and on touch based, which will be ideal for your glass object.

But I have to look up the Max possible scan dimensions of that scanner.

Cheers kev.

[yliptical]

Cheers thanks

[gabriela3d]

Hey Jesse, sorry I somehow missed your comment. Just to clarify: we understand the importance of email communication and that of evaluating the printability of a job, among others. This is why we enabled the order flow page where both customer and Hub can discuss about the print in question, even before the Hub accepts or declines it the transaction.

Moreover, we made Hubs even more easily reachable for contact, by adding clickable user profiles here on Talk, on top of the Contact This Hub button on your Hub page. We certainly don’t want to limit communication with customers, on the contrary, we’re trying to make things as smooth as possible, for you not to always switch to other platforms (email, etc). But to have everything in one place.

In hindsight, my comment might have sounded a bit harsh, but this was certainly not my intention. Hope this clarifies things.