How to get a good first layer without raft?

[Johnnyo1012]

Hey guys, we currently use a raft for almost every part we print with our FlashForge Creator Pro. We found that the bottom of parts look better without a raft. How can we get a good first layer without a raft? We have tried without raft but it doesn’t stick or does not stay in the right place. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

[Andrew_247]

Try decreasing the nozzle to bed distance a touch or two more. (Scientific term)

The only times I need a raft these days is when I’ve got a wide, flat piece prone

to warping.

[Andyjones99]

Prep the bed with cheap hairspray, seriously the cheaper the better. If you’re in the UK I use this with consistently great results: http://groceries.iceland.co.uk/insette-extra-hold-hairspray-300ml/p/56897 If you’re outside the UK look for something made from the same compounds.

[bawvu97]

What materials are you printing with?

[Andyjones99]

I use the hairspray for PLA, on the rare occasion I print with ABS I use a filament/acetone solution

[bawvu97]

I use elmers glue stick for pla with bed heated to about 60 C and my extruder at 200. I print with no issues. Have you also tried leveling or re leveling your bed

[Perry_1]

Hello JMO!

It is all about getting that first layer really squished! The first layer should look kind of overextruded, somethng I call baconing. When you see it you will know what I am referring to.

Since you are in US, the glass recommendation with Aquanet super hold is a great one.

[wirlybird]

For a FFCP the best move is probably getting a piece of borosilicate glass. I use them in a few different configs. One way is with hair spray. You need Aqua net purple can or something like it, extra hold I think is one key thing.

Glue stick is another option but google to get the right one.

On most of mine now I use a sheet of PEI applied to the glass. No spray or glue.

[SOC3D]

? This method provides good adhesion and less warp if your parts do not require any type of tolerance or detail on the bottom. Have you thought of working a bit more on your first layer adhesion to get that first layer to the proper height? Squishing the layer will cause “elephants foot” or “baconing” as you say which really reduces the quality of parts. Proper height being measure a single layer with a caliper so that it’s the height set in simplify3d. Im asking out of curiosity as we had to move away from similar adhesion methods when we started doing commercial prints in order to hit tolerances and bottom features. Our prints improved drastically and bed surfaces last longer.

[SOC3D]

What are you using for a build surface? We have 6 ffcps running and only use a raft in very select situations.

[Perry_1]

Yes, I should have said something along those lines. But it is far better than raft printing.

90% agree with your statement:

I would word as “This method provides good adhesion and less warp if your parts do not require perfect tolerances or required details on the bottom.” Yes, it is not the perfect solutions for all prints. It truly depends on customer expectation and use of part.

However, I have found many of my customers prefer the shiny, near perfect result it yields, for such things that need flat bottoms, or flat tops (in the case of, for example, a raspberry pi case.)

My first layer adhesion is not a problem when customers need tolerance, have details, etc. I was proposing a good solution to get rid of the raft, which almost always has a worse bottom than what I said. Baby steps.

[Johnnyo1012]

We are using the metal plate and tape that came with it.

[bawvu97]

Try getting a piece of borosilicate glass but make sure you print a spacer first so you don’t crash into the glass

[SOC3D]

That tape/sheet is rough polycarbonate last I checked and it takes some very precise settings to get good adhesion. Even you do get it down you’ll still have that rough surface on the bottom. Your best bet would be to use glass or PEI. We’ve had to spin up these machines in under 24 hours in the past and ended up just clamping boro glass or PEI on top of the blue sheet. It’s quick and dirty and lasts. If you don’t have temperature control in your print room go with glass and aquanet vs PEI. If you need automation on print removal go with PEI. Just get your first layer perfect with a caliper and then work on the best temps and speeds for the bed and hotend to get good adhesion. And clean the glass (IPA for aquanet water for glue stick warm water for Elmer’s glue) or PEI (IPA or acetone) after every print until you get adhesion figured out. Otherwise you’ll end up with great adhesion, clean the build plate, find out everything changed.

[Johnnyo1012]

We are using Simplify3D and found that the raft prints really well at the default speed. How can I find the raft speed and use that speed for the 1st layer in SImplify3D? I think changing the first layer speed could help me. I checked the bed leveling and it is leveled good. Please let me know. Thanks.